Confidore Tabs and Good bugs

[Paul W]

Got into a habit of putting a couple of confidore tablet in each of my pots, as I get a lot of curl grubs and have lost a few tree as a result but was just wondering especially with back pines will it affect the good bugs like the mycorizza fungus that pines seem to like
Really do not want to get into the ethical greenie side of things just want a few opinions as to whether it will kill the fungus as well.

[si90]

I don't think it should affect the micorhyza based on it's mode of action (neurotoxin). It could affect any other non harmful and beneficial insects like pollinators or praying mantids and spiders if they eat the poisoned insects if you are worried about that though.



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[KIRKY]

For Pines, its an insecticide not fungicide. So you should be fine. It will only kill insects eating the leaves of your tree.
And anything that eats the leaves on your tree is not a friendly. I have never heard of other insects dying from eating poisoned insects?????

[sheepdawg]

I have never heard of other insects dying from eating poisoned insects?????

Actually this does happen and is a bit of a problem.

On a side note that is actually interesting, this is similar to "bioaccumulation". Bioaccumulation is the accumulation of a chemical (for example, pesticides) in an organism over time. This happens as the absorption rate is higher than the excretion rate. And in many instances the chemical that is accumulated is not acutely toxic but can lead to chronic toxicity.

A real world, actual problem of bioaccumulation is that of mercury in marine life. With all the plastics and industrial runoff that is dumped into the ocean, mercury levels are increasing slightly in the ocean. This mercury is absorbed by phytoplankton (tiny little photosynthetic creatures), which doesn't harm them because the levels aren't high enough. Krill then eat the phytoplankton and absorb the mercury from them. Small fish then eat the phytoplankton, then tuna eat the small fish. As we move up each level, the relative amount of mercury increases in the organism and they can't excrete it fast enough. But then humans come along and eat the tuna with all the mercury, and now we've got ourselves into a sticky situation where we could start accumulating dangerous levels of mercury because of own actions. It's a really interesting area of study. But don't get concerned because all marine products have to be tested for mercury levels in Australia.

[si90]

Well if the insects which have died from eating the leaves contain enough of the insecticide to kill them then when they are in turn eaten by predatory insects the insecticide ends up in the predatory insects. It would all depend on breakdown rate of the insecticide and dosages etc. But I thought I would mention it if the OP was worried about that. I'm not saying for sure it would kill them off, just a consideration.

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[KIRKY]

I do understand the carry on effect etc of mercury and other toxins as explained by sheepdawg.
However, I question this in insects due to their molecular structure. The toxins explained by sheepdawg are contained in the fat cells. Thats why deep ocean fish and longer lived fish are more dangerous in there levels of mercury. I'm not sure insects have the same cellular structure. But I am sure some expert here will fill us all in.
Cheers
Kirky

[si90]

Well the insecticide is a neurotoxin and so will accumulate in the neurons of the insects which are consumed by the spiders and mantids which break the whole insect down in their guts where the insecticide will transfer into the new insect in the same way as it does from the leaves into the first insect.
Luckily with confidor the breakdown rate of the molecule is on the days to weeks scale so you don't need to worry about long term bioaccumulation.

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[Paul W]

Kirky's first answer was more in the line that I wanted, all I want to kill is the curl grubs in the soil, which is does and was worried about the fungus that's all, I am not worried about all the greenie stuff,thanks

[rodm]

Hi Paul,
Mate I have had the same problem in the past and l used Searles lawn grub killer. Sprinkle on just before watering and the next day just go round and pick them off and bin'em. Works for me. And here's the contentious issue, I've also add diatomite to my mix as I repot and haven't seen them since and haven't used grub killer for awhile
Cheers RodM