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Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: December 29th, 2008, 9:49 am
by daiviet_nguyen
All the following photos were taken on the 13/July/2008.

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I have grown this tree from a seed. When it was about one year old (2006,) I planted in this
tube, and the tube was put inside a plastic pot as seen. The purpose was to grow long roots.

I planned to do a root-over-rock with it by the end of Winter 2007, but I could not find a suitable
rock. Also lacked of times to properly look after it, so during the growing season of 2007-2008
I let the roots ran free onto the ground. I have realised since the beginning that it was a mistake,
because when the roots are big, they are almost impossible to bend into positions.

* Some basic measurements:
  • Pot height: 15 cm.
    Pot diameter: 25 cm.

    Tube length: 15 cm.
    Tube diameter: 4.5 cm.

    Tree height: 22 cm.
    Trunk diameter: 1 cm.
The tube is soft like plastic milk bottles. I bought a training trident maple in it about 10 years
ago, and I killed it shortly after. I have only one tube.

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As I have thought, roots are big and not all are suitable for my purpose. Those cannot be used
are cut off.

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* *

I have found it hard to find good rocks. The bonsai dealers seem to become collectors themselves!

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This rock is blue in colour. I am guessing that it is the kind of rocks that get crushed to make roads.
I do not know its origin. I found it while digging my front yard. It had been used as some kind of a
border for a flower bed or something, and was forgotten till I found it again. I broke a piece of it while
chiselling out the cements. I glued them back using the Selleys All Clear Multipurpose Co-Polymer
Sealant. $7.00 for 90 gram from Bunnings. The label states that it is an Australian product and
manufactured in NSW.

I have used it before to glue some small rocks into a pot. More than seven years have passed, and
they are still glued together despite being left outside the whole times.

*
* *

There are many roots, but I could select only three for use.

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The above photo shows a big gap between the rock and the trunk, I could not reduce it any further.
I felt that if I force the roots too hard, it might split. With times, hopefully this can be corrected.

I do understand that plastic grafting tapes, or raffia could use to bound the roots to the rock.
I had neither, I did not know where to find them, so I just recycled a piece of bandage (I have to
bound my left foot occasionally while jogging,) and a shoelace. I think they will do the job.

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It is potted into a big box to recuperate. The black thing on top is an upside down plastic pot that
has it bottom cut out. The rock is completely covered in soil. The plastic pot can be pulled out fairly
easily to examine the roots.

At the time of potting it, I planned that in October 2008, when it has regained sufficient strength,
I will take the plastic top out, cut a few spots on the tree big roots, and hopefully it will produce
more roots.

*
* *

Preparing another tree for Winter 2009:

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This seedling is about 1 year old. Its trunk is about 1.5 mm.

*
* *

[font=Arial]After Nearly Three Months[/font]

The following photos were taken on 04/November/2008:

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As I have hoped, it has recovered enough strength -- judging from the looks of the leaves and
young branches.

As mentioned previously, I planned to cut a few spots on the existing roots to hopefully
stimulate more roots. When I took out the plastic pot, I saw several young roots sprouting
out. In the following photos, the circles mark where the new roots can be seen:

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So I did not do anything, I just put the plastic pot back, refilled the soil, gave it more dynamic
lifter. I will let it grow freely for the rest of the 2008 season.

I would like to reduce the height of the tree a bit further, but for this season I need to the
roots developed. That is the reason why I will let it grow freely.

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: December 29th, 2008, 10:02 am
by Jon Chown
Great Post Viet - I have done several of these projects and the main issue is patience and time left with the roots covered. I use a grafting tape to bind the roots tightly to the rock so that as they thicken they fill all of the spaces on the rock.

Jon

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: December 29th, 2008, 2:32 pm
by anttal63
nice one viet i look forward to seeing its future. :D

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: December 29th, 2008, 7:02 pm
by Bretts
Thanks for the great post Viet :)

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: December 29th, 2008, 8:33 pm
by Steven
Great post Viet, thanks!
Not only are you creating great bonsai but you are documenting and sharing the techniques with us really well. I always enjoy reading your progress posts!
Thanks again mate,
Steven

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 25th, 2009, 12:26 pm
by daiviet_nguyen
I hope this post is not getting too boring... :)

After a Growing Season

From November 2008 I have let this tree grew freely. A few roots actually broke
through the foam box and went underground.

It grew strongly. The leaf-size was about double that of others' that I have.
The longest stems grew to about 76 cm.

I found that I have to re-arrange the roots again. This time I have plenty to
work with. The photos below were taken on the 19/July/2009:

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I cut it off severely again. I have also cut of an original and big root. This
root has not developed the way that I expected to.

This growing season I hope to develop a few lower branches. I might even reduce
the height a bit further. I plan to let the roots go underground too. I have
potted it exactly as it was last year. Now it does not look different to the
one from last year!

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 25th, 2009, 1:35 pm
by Elias
Another well recorded progression, very nice work Daiviet. This year I'm trying to do something similar with a Trident Maple, if all goes well I will post some pics in future.

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 18th, 2012, 5:54 pm
by siddhar
Bout time this thread was bumped... :bump: :bump: very interested to see if this tree is still in your collection or alive daiviet :?: :?:

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 18th, 2012, 7:37 pm
by Barry1
Nice to see people taking the time to document the progression of a project ...well done daiviet :tu:

Barry

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 18th, 2012, 10:51 pm
by Andrew Legg
siddhar wrote:Bout time this thread was bumped... :bump: :bump: very interested to see if this tree is still in your collection or alive daiviet :?: :?:
No pressure Daiviet :lol: :whistle:

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 19th, 2012, 1:59 pm
by kcpoole
I have added this thread to the wikin page for Root over rock so it can be easily found again
https://www.ausbonsai.com.au/wiki/index. ... rock_style

Ken

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 19th, 2012, 2:17 pm
by reddoggy
Nearly 3 years has passed since we heard anything ,the tree might have gone to god,if not it would be good to see it especially if it is now in the wiki,might have to be renamed how not to do a root over rock. :lol:

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 19th, 2012, 5:13 pm
by kcpoole
reddoggy wrote:Nearly 3 years has passed since we heard anything ,the tree might have gone to god,if not it would be good to see it especially if it is now in the wiki,might have to be renamed how not to do a root over rock. :lol:
the wiki will not care if it is deceased, at least the original technique is sound :D
Ken

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 21st, 2012, 8:16 pm
by daiviet_nguyen
Hi siddhar and Andrew,

Thank you bumping it up :)

Hi Barry,

Thank you for reading.

Hi Ken,

Thank you adding it to the Wiki :) Might I add my other tridents roots on rock:

http://www.ausbonsai.com/forum/viewtopi ... =104&t=448
http://www.ausbonsai.com/forum/viewtopi ... =104&t=519
http://www.ausbonsai.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=215 -- Got stolen.
http://www.ausbonsai.com/forum/viewtopi ... 104&t=1612 -- My best one. Got stolen too.

Hi reddoggy,

I did killed my first trident in an attempt on ROR. I actually split the trunk in halves and tied it to the rock, the poor thing promptly died :). Since then, I lost none. They are actually is a very hardy species, they tolerate root works very well. They do not like the head and dried out.

Best regards gents.

Re: Trident maple root-over-rock (1)

Posted: July 21st, 2012, 8:16 pm
by daiviet_nguyen
I "repotted" it today, 21/07/2012, the follow photos were taken on the same day.

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View 2 - 1

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View 2 - 2

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View 2 - 3

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View 2 - 4

Not much at all happened to roots that was my conclusion after it was washed!

Although the gaps on top has closed a little.

Compare to my other tridents in deep pots, and of the same crop as this one, their roots after one season are just fantastic.

I attribute this bad development to bad potting mix: they are too fine. And after three seasons of dynamic lifter, it gets rather muddy too. I never actually let the roots run down to ground.

I put it to the ground today -- completely bury the rock. Depending on how it goes, I might dig it up next year.

-- From View 2 - 3, I really hope that the black root (still alive) that runs over the top of the rock and down the back develops well. This is an important one in this composition.