Page 1 of 2
new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 5:26 pm
by Todd
Hi everyone,
I've been interested in bonsai for while now and decided to give it a go! For my first tree I got a little jbp. I have read through alot of this forum and have a rough idea on what to do but just a few things im unsure of.
rps20140825_172219.jpg
rps20140825_172244.jpg
1. I want to grow the top leader on to thicken the trunk up. Should I just select the strongest leader and remove the rest or keep some shoots for future branches?
2. There is about 3cm of loose soil covering the roots and base of the tree. Should I remove it or leave it to protect the roots?
3. I live on the gold coast, Does anyone know what week of what month to remove the candels to get a second lot in the summer?
Any other advice you can give on what this plant needs would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance and sorry for the newbie questions
Todd
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 5:37 pm
by Bush bunny
Hello Todd, no questions are stupid. It looks like a Japanese white pine to me, Pinus parvifoliar.
Is it or a Japanese black pine. Five needle bunches as against two needle? But I will let more experienced bonsaiers to answer your question, as I am a beginner too.
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 5:39 pm
by Bush bunny
One a second look could be a Scotch pine, 2 needle bunches.
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 5:53 pm
by Todd
I was told it was a black pine when I bought it...
I dont know enough to be able to id pines yet so I just asume thats what it is
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 8:00 pm
by rodm
G'day mate,
Where did you buy it from? If you bought from a local general nursery it could be one of three typical pines sold jbp? Radiate pine or may be a slash pine. But what ever it is, to thicken up the trunk you need to have a sacrifice branch ie one largish down low for the energy to help thicken the trunk. Also given it plenty of fert, I use dynamic lifter, as well as the Seasol/power feed combo as a tonic and liquid fert every fortnight in the growing season. Others might tell you something, that's fine, all you have to done is pick the ones you like and go with it.
If it was me I'd be having a look at the nebari( roots on the surface) and keep'em out to develop them. A top book for pines authored by Leong Kwong at bonsaisouth in Sydney, all the info on pines you will need
Cheers Rod
Ps:- you could always your pine in the ground for a few years, again feed it up good. But that's another way of doing trunk thickening
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 8:12 pm
by shibui
Looks enough like a black pine to me and I've seen a few....
Todd, pity you have chosen a pine as your first tree
They need special attention as far as pruning. If you do it wrong you do not get a second chance. Maples and elms are much more forgiving and can be cut back to bare wood and will still produce new shoots.
You MUST keep shoots to develop new branches on pines. Pines do not always shoot on bare wood so if you want to grow a sacrifice branch you must also have shoots below to cut back to after thickening is completed.
You do not need to worry about decandling while your pine is in development. You can allow all shoots to grow unhindered as long as there are needles to cut back to. Needles stay for around 2 years so you can allow shoots to grow long for a whole year at least.
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 25th, 2014, 8:50 pm
by Todd
Thanks for the advice guys
I got it from my local bonsai nursery. I know pines are alot of work but I just love the look of them and if I can keep this one alive maybe later on I can treat myself to a better piece of material. For now I will give it some fert and hopefully keep it strong and healthy for a few years
Shibui I also got a juniper as a back up but will look into a maple or elm. Would you suggest any particular species for the goldcoast climate?
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 12:19 pm
by Bush bunny
I bought a Pine 5 years ago from the Armidale Bonsai society. For $3.00 about 10 inches high if that. I think it is a radiata. Anyway, it is now about three feet high in a big pot, and from look of yours they have removed some of the candles already. So - if it me, I would let it grow. See what it does.
Usually you wait till the candles are about 1 - 1 1/2 inch high and you pluck them out . This encourages shorter needles on the new growth of candles. There is something about white pines, whereas with Scotch or others two needle pines you don't pinch all the candles out at one time, and start from the top with two needles pines and from the bottom with white pine. Better look it up in your book? But I agree they aren't the easiest for beginners but you'll cope? Just don't kill it with too much pruning.
Gold coast or sunshine coast, keep it moist. Part shade. And vapor spray the needles in the mornings, so I have read. Pines are high altitude forest trees and prefer moist and organic soil. Then leave the water off during the winter but keep it damp. But maybe where you are you don't get much of a winter anyway? Not like the Northern Tablelands.
I'll take some pics of mine.
Cheers
Pat
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 1:35 pm
by Laurie J
Bush Bunny, it might be a good idea to start your own thread with Wild Willy in it instead of commenting on the current one. I would hate for the new person to feel like their thread has been hijacked
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 2:20 pm
by Bush bunny
Oh Sorry I thought I was being helpful.
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 2:39 pm
by kcpoole
Bush bunny wrote:Oh Sorry I thought I was being helpful.
I have split your 2 posts out into its own thread here
viewtopic.php?f=131&t=18433
Keep that thread updated with its progress
As a photographing tip, Take pics of your trees from a position just above the soil level and looking into the tree up against a plain background.
This gives a perspective similar to how we view trees in real life.
The view from above ( unless highliting a feature) is really hard to see the structure of the tree
Ken
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 2:42 pm
by Laurie J
Bush bunny wrote:Oh Sorry I thought I was being helpful.
I enjoy reading your posts Pat, I think your tree deserved a thread of its own instead of coming in half way through this one
To gcbonsai, I have absolutely no experience with pines, and will be watching this thread to see what you can do with it. Good luck!
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 4:38 pm
by Neli
gcbonsai wrote:Hi everyone,
I've been interested in bonsai for while now and decided to give it a go! For my first tree I got a little jbp. I have read through alot of this forum and have a rough idea on what to do but just a few things im unsure of.
rps20140825_172219.jpg
rps20140825_172244.jpg
1. I want to grow the top leader on to thicken the trunk up. Should I just select the strongest leader and remove the rest or keep some shoots for future branches?
I would select branches even now...and start working on them...keeping the foliage closer to the trunk. leave the first 2-3 branches as future branches...and the one above as future leader...everything above that consider as sacrifice branch. and the first back brunch as sacrifice also. You can decide chop the top sacrifice now or later...wire sacrifice brunches away not to shade the lower portions and you need to balance their growth. normally sacrifice branches are left to grow free and side shoots are removed.
http://bonsainut.com/forums/showthread. ... black+pine
I dont know who removed the needles along the branches...is it you? You needed those needles to cut back to...so you induce back budding and bring the foliage closer to the trunk.
2. There is about 3cm of loose soil covering the roots and base of the tree. Should I remove it or leave it to protect the roots?
3. I live on the gold coast, Does anyone know what week of what month to remove the candels to get a second lot in the summer?
I keep my pines under light shade...I have similar conditions to yours.
Any other advice you can give on what this plant needs would be greatly appreciated.
Fertilize and cut back in autumn, dont decandle the branches you need...just cut back to oldest needles to induce budding, and bring foliage closer to the trunk...ones that is done use sacrifice branches to thicken branches while you keep developing what You need, by cutting back or decandling
Thanks in advance and sorry for the newbie questions
Todd
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 26th, 2014, 8:39 pm
by Todd
Thanks neli!
I was told to remove the long needles when I bought it... so being exited about my first bonsai thats what I did and it wasn't until I researched jbp that I realized I needed the needles
will it not back bud at all now?
Re: new to bonsai first jbp
Posted: August 27th, 2014, 1:21 am
by Neli
Lets hope it will backbud...but you can not cut it back now...you need healthy need;es to cut back to...well we all learn from mistakes.