AusBonsai

Posted: **July 8th, 2013, 2:18 pm**

dansai wrote:Hi Ray

As mentioned before I read somewhere that a layer on a node gives the best results for pines by which I assume they meant where a whorl of branches are. I read it somewhere on Ab, but after a lot of searching still cannot find the thread.

I suppose I have a few options. There is a straight section of trunk and then a whorl of branches, all of which have good curves in them as shown in pic 3 and 4. There are 2 weak branches, 5 reasonably strong ones and the central ones which has another whorl of branches towards the top.

So the options as I see them now.

1. Air layer the central trunk off above the whorl. Then next season, or at the same time, remove the 2 weak branches and air layer on the node to create a 5 tree clump.
2. As above, but separate the trunks after roots have formed. (Assuming all trunks have formed roots!!)
3. Air layer each branch, bar the weak ones, above the node to obtain 6 trees. Or if this is too much in one hit, maybe only do 3 and remove the rest.

All branches on the top section have strong buds ready for growth come spring.

Hi Dan,
I would go with your point 3. Each of the branches have strong growth which is ideal for doing the layers. You could take off the two weak branches. Make sure you leave sufficient stub on the trunk where you remove these two branches.

I have quoted what I said earlier concerning when to do the layers. I'm sure doing them at this time will contribute to the layers being successful.

You will notice I did the layer in November. If you look at the first photo you will see the candles have been cut back. These are the strong candles you get in Spring. I cut these back by half. I then waited a couple of weeks and then did the layers.

I removed the layers in March, the next year. You will see from the photos that the second candle growth was looking quite healthy. When I saw the candles growing so well I thought the roots should be doing well. It was after I checked the roots and saw how many roots there was I decided to remove the layers.

I intend to do some more layers myself this year. There are still a number of branches on the stock tree that would be candidates for layering. I guess we will be able to share information as we would being doing the layers about the same time.

Regards Ray

Posted: **July 8th, 2013, 8:44 pm**

Thanks Ray.

So should I leave all the older needles on for now?

Cheers Dan

Posted: **July 8th, 2013, 9:20 pm**

dansai wrote:Thanks Ray.

So should I leave all the older needles on for now?

Cheers Dan

Hi Dan,
I would leave it alone until it's time to cut back the candles. If there are any dead needles you could remove those. Do a check in the thick foliage and make sure there are no spider nests etc.

Regards Ray

Posted: **November 6th, 2013, 5:55 pm**

Hi Ray,

Is it about time to look at doing these layers. The tree in question has been slow to extend candles but they are getting some movement now. I can post pics by the weekend if that helps.

Posted: **November 6th, 2013, 6:06 pm**

dansai wrote:Hi Ray,

Is it about time to look at doing these layers. The tree in question has been slow to extend candles but they are getting some movement now. I can post pics by the weekend if that helps.

Hi Dan,
Yes mate, please post some photos. I did three black pine layers at the School of Bonsai exhibition. I am also doing some more trees this coming weekend. I have been invited to do a demonstration on some unusual trees. I am looking forward to see the trees and the potential of layering them.

Regards Ray

Posted: **November 8th, 2013, 2:20 pm**

healthy pine layers, inspirational

Posted: **November 9th, 2013, 1:29 pm**

bonsaiLov wrote:healthy pine layers, inspirational

Hi bonsaiLov,
The trees have put on even more growth since the last photos. I took the trees up to Ray Nesci's the other day for him to have a look at, as he wants me to do some Black Pines for him. It was very interesting watching Ray checking the pines. The first thing he did was to hold the trunk and pot and see how firmly the trees were established. They didn't move, so that was a good sign that the roots have taken very well. I feel quite confident now that the trees are at a stage where they could start to have some shaping done to them.

IMG_7403 -2.jpg

IMG_7405 -2.jpg

IMG_7406 -2.jpg

IMG_7407 -2.jpg

Regards Ray

Posted: **November 10th, 2013, 3:37 pm**

Hi Ray

Current pictures of the pine in question are below. If you want more pictures or different angles let me know. The last picture shows the area I was looking to layer.

JBP 2 AL-1.jpg

JBP 2 AL-2.jpg

JBP 2 AL-3.jpg

Posted: **November 17th, 2013, 6:18 am**

Well I finally got to do my layers. I followed RayM's technique which is outlined in his book on layering Trident Maples. He has found it has worked well with other hard to layer species.

Unfortunately I only had a small amount of sphagnum moss left and my local nursery doesn't carry it and the big green shed is too far away.

So on 2 of the layers I have used coarse cocopeat that I removed the larger chunks from. The larger one has sphagnum moss though.

All set up ready to work.

JBP Layer-2.jpg

The site for layering

JBP Layer-1.jpg

The bark removed. Unfortunately I cut straight through one branch.

JBP Layer-3.jpg

The layers complete.

JBP Layer-4.jpg

Posted: **February 8th, 2014, 5:03 pm**

Hi everyone,
I had a look at the layers on the Black Pine I used to demonstrate at the School of Bonsai exhibition.

The layers were applied, 19-20 October 2013. I checked them yesterday, 7 February 2014. I'm happy with the results. I'll take the layers off toward the end of this month.

IMG_8018 -2.jpg

IMG_8024 -2.jpg

IMG_8026 -2.jpg

Regards Ray

Posted: **February 8th, 2014, 6:33 pm**

dansai wrote:Well I finally got to do my layers. I followed RayM's technique which is outlined in his book on layering Trident Maples....

I've seen reference to this book from Ray twice now. Where can I get a hold of it?

Cheers
EZ
By Tapatalk

Posted: **February 8th, 2014, 8:24 pm**

CoGRedeMptioN wrote:
dansai wrote:Well I finally got to do my layers. I followed RayM's technique which is outlined in his book on layering Trident Maples....
I've seen reference to this book from Ray twice now. Where can I get a hold of it?

Cheers
EZ
By Tapatalk

Hi EZ,
I will PM you with the information you need.

Regards Ray

Posted: **February 8th, 2014, 8:51 pm**

Ray M wrote: Hi EZ,
I will PM you with the information you need.

Regards Ray

Thanx Ray, appreciate it.

Everywhere we go I now find myself checking out trees ... Problem is they're outside shops on the foot path, along the roads ... Lol, not sure if I can take any cuttings ... Ooh!

Cheers
EZ
By Tapatalk

Posted: **February 12th, 2014, 9:07 am**

Hi all,
A correction to my post February 8th. I doubled up on one of the photos. The following is the correct photo for the third layer.

IMG_8020 -2.jpg

Regards Ray

Posted: **March 17th, 2014, 5:15 pm**

Hi all,
Here are some update photos of the three layers I did in October 2013.

In the first 3 photos you will see the roots are very thick. I left the layers on for 5 months. They should have been taken off at least a month earlier.

I even spared no expense and purchased some new colanders for them.

IMG_8145 -2.jpg

IMG_8146 -2.jpg

IMG_8147 -2.jpg

IMG_8162 -2.jpg

IMG_8163 -2.jpg

IMG_8164 -2.jpg

Regards Ray

AusBonsai

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