Do you guys let your ficus get leggy and build some energy over late autumn/winter in sydney or do you prune it back to shape in the cold. Im not wanting anymore thickness, just bifurcation.
Health vs ramification: what are your thoughts?
Cheers
Nic
Pruning ficus in winter
-
NickityNic
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 37
- Joined: February 22nd, 2022, 8:11 pm
- Favorite Species: Ficus
- Bonsai Age: 3
- Location: Sydney
- Been thanked: 2 times
-
TimIAm
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 212
- Joined: April 6th, 2019, 10:46 am
- Favorite Species: Ficus, Elm, Juniper
- Bonsai Age: 0
- Location: Sydney
- Has thanked: 229 times
- Been thanked: 89 times
Re: Pruning ficus in winter
Short answer: On more refined ficus I don't cut back for ramification unless there are already new buds ready to go. I'm also in Sydney and I'm not cutting back now because although the current buds are showing growth, when I've cut back in the past, new buds don't push until spring (they may appear but they don't grow). So I feel it's better for the general health of the tree to wait until mid-October in Sydney when you can feel the weather starting to warm.
Long answer:
I have a ficus that I've been trying to build up a lot of ramification but keep it super compact, I've been working it hard for the past 2 years. If your goal is ramification, what is going to drive that is new buds.
If you cut back on a thick branch on a healthy ficus you are going to get a whole bunch of new buds. But the smaller and more ramified the branch the less buds. In the past I've been less patient and have had the tree give up on thinner ends where there were no buds available. The end just shrivelled up. So, now I don't cut off tips unless there are at least 2 new buds ready to go.
Arrows showing new buds available before cutting back.
Another thing to consider is general health. Some say continually cutting back growth tips will weaken the tree, but even with a fat healthy ficus, regular/repeated full defoliation, or chopping all of the growth tips off to chase high levels of ramification will slow down growth.
With the goal of building high levels of ramification, you want your tree to be really vigorous because we want the tree to keep giving us new buds. The tree mentioned before has been a lot of learning and some battles. One of those battles is developing a nice surface level root spread. There was a point in the past where I pushed it too far and it just halted above and below.
One unanswered question I have is the value of a full defoliation on really refined ficus? I've seen it before and maybe someone on here like @qitianlong might have a better idea. I've seen plenty of posts where it's been done on a ficus, but I'm not sure if this is done at the beginning of spring when the tree is really pushing new buds. At this current stage where I have a partially refined tree but different branches are at different stages I'm a bit reluctant to do an all over, but it's something I think may be worthwhile when everything catches up and is balanced across the whole tree.
Personally, if I already have primary and most secondary branches in place, I think the best approach is to keep a PJF healthy and work with the tree as it puts out new buds to build more ramification. More patience can lead to tighter, smaller internodes with dense growth at the tips. PJF can put out really tiny leaves (stable in size and below 2cm) if you work it right.
Long answer:
I have a ficus that I've been trying to build up a lot of ramification but keep it super compact, I've been working it hard for the past 2 years. If your goal is ramification, what is going to drive that is new buds.
If you cut back on a thick branch on a healthy ficus you are going to get a whole bunch of new buds. But the smaller and more ramified the branch the less buds. In the past I've been less patient and have had the tree give up on thinner ends where there were no buds available. The end just shrivelled up. So, now I don't cut off tips unless there are at least 2 new buds ready to go.
Arrows showing new buds available before cutting back.
Another thing to consider is general health. Some say continually cutting back growth tips will weaken the tree, but even with a fat healthy ficus, regular/repeated full defoliation, or chopping all of the growth tips off to chase high levels of ramification will slow down growth.
With the goal of building high levels of ramification, you want your tree to be really vigorous because we want the tree to keep giving us new buds. The tree mentioned before has been a lot of learning and some battles. One of those battles is developing a nice surface level root spread. There was a point in the past where I pushed it too far and it just halted above and below.
One unanswered question I have is the value of a full defoliation on really refined ficus? I've seen it before and maybe someone on here like @qitianlong might have a better idea. I've seen plenty of posts where it's been done on a ficus, but I'm not sure if this is done at the beginning of spring when the tree is really pushing new buds. At this current stage where I have a partially refined tree but different branches are at different stages I'm a bit reluctant to do an all over, but it's something I think may be worthwhile when everything catches up and is balanced across the whole tree.
Personally, if I already have primary and most secondary branches in place, I think the best approach is to keep a PJF healthy and work with the tree as it puts out new buds to build more ramification. More patience can lead to tighter, smaller internodes with dense growth at the tips. PJF can put out really tiny leaves (stable in size and below 2cm) if you work it right.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
-
NickityNic
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 37
- Joined: February 22nd, 2022, 8:11 pm
- Favorite Species: Ficus
- Bonsai Age: 3
- Location: Sydney
- Been thanked: 2 times
Re: Pruning ficus in winter
I read that answer a few times over, thanks for such a detailed responce sir!
I think i will take your advice, let the tree get a bit unkempt and shaggy for the winter then hope for a really positive reaction to some pruning when the night temps get back up to 15 degrees.
Cheers mate!
I think i will take your advice, let the tree get a bit unkempt and shaggy for the winter then hope for a really positive reaction to some pruning when the night temps get back up to 15 degrees.
Cheers mate!
-
shibui
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 7692
- Joined: August 22nd, 2009, 8:41 pm
- Favorite Species: trident maple
- Bonsai Age: 41
- Bonsai Club: Albury/Wodonga; BSV; Canberra; VNBC
- Location: Yackandandah
- Has thanked: 68 times
- Been thanked: 1435 times
- Contact:
Re: Pruning ficus in winter
It will be interesting to see if your tree does get 'shaggy and unkempt' over winter.
When I read @Tim's response I think he implies that there is little growth over winter so maybe your tree won't get as bad as you think.
Growth depends a lot on local conditions. You have not clarified whether the tree in question is indoors in heated conditions or outside. Or whether you are inner city (warmer) or hills (cooler). Growth definitely stops down here in the cooler climes but ficus grow all year round further north. Sydney is borderline depending where you live and where the tree is kept.
If your tree is getting out of hand through winter I'd still prune because it's obvious it is still warm enough for them to grow and recover from pruning. Take advantage of growth whenever it happens in your location.
Having a tree get a little 'unkempt' is not the end of the world and seems to be good for future health and vitality. I certainly don't aim to have all my maples in show condition all year round and I find I get better response (more new buds) when pruning longer/older shoots V pinching very small/younger shoots.
When I read @Tim's response I think he implies that there is little growth over winter so maybe your tree won't get as bad as you think.
Growth depends a lot on local conditions. You have not clarified whether the tree in question is indoors in heated conditions or outside. Or whether you are inner city (warmer) or hills (cooler). Growth definitely stops down here in the cooler climes but ficus grow all year round further north. Sydney is borderline depending where you live and where the tree is kept.
If your tree is getting out of hand through winter I'd still prune because it's obvious it is still warm enough for them to grow and recover from pruning. Take advantage of growth whenever it happens in your location.
Having a tree get a little 'unkempt' is not the end of the world and seems to be good for future health and vitality. I certainly don't aim to have all my maples in show condition all year round and I find I get better response (more new buds) when pruning longer/older shoots V pinching very small/younger shoots.
http://shibuibonsai.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
-
TimIAm
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 212
- Joined: April 6th, 2019, 10:46 am
- Favorite Species: Ficus, Elm, Juniper
- Bonsai Age: 0
- Location: Sydney
- Has thanked: 229 times
- Been thanked: 89 times
Re: Pruning ficus in winter
I'm Sydney metro and it doesn't get that cold here. I do get growth over winter. What I was trying to imply is that if you cut back now as we are heading into winter won't get a response from the tree until after the weather has warmed up.
So, I am weighing up cutting and getting delayed response vs. winter growth.
As we both suggested, I think it's better for the health of the tree to just wait out winter and use the winter growth to drive new growth after pruning when the weather gets warmer.
So, I am weighing up cutting and getting delayed response vs. winter growth.
As we both suggested, I think it's better for the health of the tree to just wait out winter and use the winter growth to drive new growth after pruning when the weather gets warmer.
